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8 | 22ND - 28TH JULY 2016 | UTILITY WEEK Interview schemes," says Curtin. "We are aligning better with one another [with the water companies] and with each of our energies." One scheme that Curtin highlights as a prime example of catchment thinking and a partnership between the agency and a water company is a project at Brunton Park, New- castle. This saw the creation of a new river channel and a sustainable drainage system, and improvements to the existing drains. Construction work began in October 2014 and was completed earlier this month. He jokes: "The only downside was that we had to take two holes out of a golf course – that was hardest thing. I've spoken to the golfers and they're happy as they've got water features on their holes, which they really love! "There are multiple benefits. We have created a sec- ond river, allowing Northumbrian Water to use the origi- nal river channel for surface runoff, and we've got an extra wildlife habitat and an extra river to reduce flood risk." Bradshaw interjects: "What John and I are trying to do is bring the two elements together. Under the river basin management plans, we've got partnerships in well over 100 catchments, and there is some really good stuff going on." With the cuts to the EA's budget and water companies seeing their returns trimmed back by Ofwat in this AMP, making the most of pooled resources is key, and the Brunton Park project shows what can be achieved. Curtin says: "What's coming with that are more effi- ciency targets; we have to work closely with water com- panies as and where we can. With the Northumbrian project, those two projects cost less than one of them would have on their own due to cost efficiencies and the economies of scale of both of us working together. "This means they get to charge their customers less and we get to do more with the money we have." Bradshaw cuts in to broaden the conversation to sus- tainable urban drainage systems as a whole. "There are amazing examples of where city centres can be greened and hold water up in a dual-benefit way. It will also green the city, creating a sense of wellbeing and a sense of liv- ing in a nice place rather than just in a concrete jungle." This ideal of partnership working goes beyond flood mitigation, and Bradshaw says it will affect the radical plans being developed for abstraction reform and limit the damage to the environment caused by over-abstraction. This follows calls made previously by the agency for dynamic abstraction reform to be introduced by the gov- ernment. Bradshaw insists the reforms will address the key problem that water "hasn't been properly valued". He adds that the move will allow trading to happen, as well as dynamic licensing to allow water companies, and other abstractors such as farmers, to take water from rivers and other sources when flows are high, such as aer intense periods of summer rainfall. "This is quite radical thinking," Bradshaw says. "It will need a lot of resourcing and we need to work closely with Defra and utilities to get it working. But it does at last give the proper value to water. We should ensure in scarce catchments it is being used optimally." It's at this point that Curtin leans forwards out of his chair and points out that he used to be a hydrologist and therefore has an interest in this area, particularly sur- rounding how climate change is forcing views to alter. "What I have noted is how much we have relied on past records to say what the future will hold. If we have a dynamic and changing climate, do we need to look again at those underlying assumptions? "That is part of what the national flood resilience programme has been looking at and what abstraction reform will have to look at." On the issue of things changing, the small matter of the European Union referendum is addressed and dis- missed, at least for now. "For the next two years, at least, we will continue to do what we have always done," says Bradshaw, unper- turbed. "We will still protect the environment, wildlife and people. It will be business as usual and it's impor- tant to remember that we don't get people to do stuff because of European laws; we do it to protect the envi- ronment and 96 per cent of businesses are compliant." Another big area of change on the horizon is the opening of the retail market in the water sector in April 2017 for non-household customers, along with the pos- sibility for household competition (see p26). The Drinking Water Inspectorate has previously raised concerns with Utility Week that competition could affect water quality because of the added complex- ity of the market. The two men are aware of the poten- tial implications and want to be prepared for them, but expect it to drive further improvements. "What we've generally said is this can drive invest- ment and innovation and therefore should be sup- ported," says Bradshaw. "But markets can fail and we have to make sure there is some proper risk management in place so you're not in a position where companies go under and people are disadvantaged or water supplies are somehow falling in quality. "There is no reason any of that should happen, but we have to make sure that kind of risk management is built in." Curtin echoes his cautious optimism, saying it will be "interesting to see how the market and the consumer goes with it", before adding that the agency and the sector will have to go in with their "eyes wide open" to ensure there are no damaging incidents of over-abstrac- tion, flooding or pollution. Work to drive water efficiency savings and cut down on pollution incidents and flooding has been going on under the EA's guidance for the past 20 years. Bradshaw says he has noticed a "positive trend" in particular over the past ten years. "We're dealing with half the number of serious pollution incidents," he adds with pride. The plan is for that improvement to continue over the next decade as the challenges of climate change, popula- tion growth and ever tighter budgets get tougher. Taking this on, Bradshaw and Curtin are clear that partnership working is vital, and the friendship between the two, forged in the floodwaters of last winter, is obvi- ous as they round off the interview with how they take their work home with them. "We take this seriously," Bradshaw says. "I have argu- ments with my wife because I turn the TV off every five minutes. We have a dual-flush TV – I mean toilet – that really would be cutting edge!" Curtin laughs, joking he hasn't got one of those yet. He adds that it is second nature to them, and their aim is for protecting the environment from the extremes of drought and flooding, as well as from pollution, to become second nature to the water companies and government, too. "We don't get people to do stuff because of European laws; we do it to protect the environment"